1 00:00:00,810 --> 00:00:05,430 Okay, let's begin. Hi, everybody, and welcome to this PSM two session. Today 2 00:00:05,430 --> 00:00:09,810 we're going to be talking about dark sectors. And our first talk is from Brian, 3 00:00:09,810 --> 00:00:13,440 who will give us the theoretical background to this, all of the talks today 4 00:00:13,440 --> 00:00:18,060 will be 15 minutes, they'll have a three minute time for questions afterwards. And 5 00:00:18,060 --> 00:00:21,150 if we have a little time left over at the end, we can discuss with all the panelists 6 00:00:21,150 --> 00:00:23,970 then. So I'm fine, feel free to get started. 7 00:00:25,320 --> 00:00:28,230 Thanks very much for inviting me. And thanks to the organizers for organizing 8 00:00:28,230 --> 00:00:33,540 this wonderful online meeting. So I have the tall task of giving an overview of 9 00:00:33,540 --> 00:00:39,930 hidden sector theory in 15 minutes. So let's get started. So the reason why we 10 00:00:39,930 --> 00:00:45,270 believe in the existence of hidden sectors and why all of the impressive searches 11 00:00:45,270 --> 00:00:48,930 that you're seeing presented this conference are taking place is because of 12 00:00:48,930 --> 00:00:52,110 a bunch of things that we don't understand, that can't be explained by the 13 00:00:52,110 --> 00:00:57,330 standard model. These are of course, questions of dark matter. The origins of 14 00:00:57,330 --> 00:01:03,360 the matter antimatter asymmetry, and also neutrino oscillations. And in each of 15 00:01:03,360 --> 00:01:07,470 these cases, the evidence is pointing towards new particles and interactions 16 00:01:07,470 --> 00:01:12,990 that are very weakly coupled with the standard model. And also where the new 17 00:01:13,080 --> 00:01:18,180 particles and forces responsible for this phenomena could happen at really any mass 18 00:01:18,180 --> 00:01:24,360 scale ranging from Evie up to maybe the guts scale and beyond for some of these 19 00:01:24,540 --> 00:01:29,400 interactions. And so it gives us a rich array of kinds of theories that we should 20 00:01:29,400 --> 00:01:35,190 be trying to study in whatever experiments we have. And as I'm sure you're all aware, 21 00:01:35,190 --> 00:01:41,100 there's a proliferation of theories of hidden sectors and what they could do. So 22 00:01:41,100 --> 00:01:47,580 one of the pictures I tried to keep in mind when trying to make sense of this 23 00:01:48,060 --> 00:01:54,240 really extensive set of interactions that could be out there is to try and think 24 00:01:54,240 --> 00:01:58,140 about terms of the signatures, how can I organize them and maybe group them into 25 00:01:58,140 --> 00:02:04,920 categories and I think tried to do that here by adopting, perhaps an organization 26 00:02:04,920 --> 00:02:09,990 scheme that we've seen before and for instance, tried to tackle Susie or there 27 00:02:09,990 --> 00:02:14,010 is a strong dynamics in terms of trying to come up with what are the irreducible non 28 00:02:14,010 --> 00:02:18,960 logical features of the theory? And how can we look for those. And the simplest 29 00:02:18,960 --> 00:02:23,190 place to start is a theory with a single particle and some relatively well 30 00:02:23,190 --> 00:02:26,820 prescribed set of interactions. And these are the things that have become sort of 31 00:02:26,820 --> 00:02:32,190 the canonical example so far kinetically, mixed dark photon, singlet scalar that 32 00:02:32,190 --> 00:02:34,800 mixes the Higgs sterile neutrino and so on. 33 00:02:36,120 --> 00:02:40,380 And for the most part, we have a pretty good understanding of what these look like 34 00:02:40,380 --> 00:02:44,460 how we can look for them. And there's a robust search program to look for those, 35 00:02:44,970 --> 00:02:49,170 we can then move beyond this single particle and imagine what happens if I 36 00:02:49,170 --> 00:02:54,510 have say, two particles that I connect and suddenly the array of signatures becomes 37 00:02:54,510 --> 00:02:59,400 much more vast because I have for instance, a different possible production 38 00:02:59,400 --> 00:03:04,350 mechanism. From decay mechanism so for instance, I could make dark Higgs is from 39 00:03:04,350 --> 00:03:10,050 the decay of a vector and then you know, the the decay comes through the scalar 40 00:03:10,050 --> 00:03:16,110 mixing or vice versa. And so suddenly we have a different range of production, 41 00:03:16,110 --> 00:03:22,380 cross sections, decay mechanisms, lifetimes, and so on. And in many cases, 42 00:03:22,380 --> 00:03:27,030 more becomes a very different. So it's not just like, Oh, I got different, a few 43 00:03:27,030 --> 00:03:31,530 different signatures, all of which will look similar to the single particle cases. 44 00:03:31,530 --> 00:03:35,310 But in many cases, the single particle signatures go away and I got some new 45 00:03:35,310 --> 00:03:40,620 ones. And this goes all the way up to a more complicated code complete model, 46 00:03:40,620 --> 00:03:46,170 which could have, you know, a set of 10s or hundreds of particles. And this could 47 00:03:46,170 --> 00:03:50,580 lead to very sophisticated things like showers and things that reproduce features 48 00:03:50,580 --> 00:03:54,600 from the standard model. And so I think what we want to do is March from the 49 00:03:54,600 --> 00:03:58,590 simpler examples that we've been looking at towards these more complicated ones. 50 00:03:59,220 --> 00:04:04,890 And of course, There are many ways that we can move forward. And I hope to talk about 51 00:04:04,920 --> 00:04:09,600 just three of these today, or at least you touch on what I think some of the 52 00:04:09,600 --> 00:04:14,520 interesting directions are. And then hopefully, those of you who are 53 00:04:14,520 --> 00:04:18,420 experimentalists looking for something to do. If you're bored, you can follow some 54 00:04:18,420 --> 00:04:23,310 of the references or Google some of these ideas and see what, what more we could be 55 00:04:23,310 --> 00:04:27,210 doing. And I've kind of grouped these roughly under sort of non minimal 56 00:04:27,210 --> 00:04:31,410 couplings meaning coupling patterns that deviate from the canonical examples of 57 00:04:31,410 --> 00:04:38,370 dark photon dark Higgs, etc. Non thermodynamics So, this specifically is 58 00:04:38,370 --> 00:04:41,640 interesting from the point of view of dark matter, but, you know, we have a well 59 00:04:41,640 --> 00:04:46,800 prescribed Dark Matter program at the Elysee. And this is of course, predicated 60 00:04:46,800 --> 00:04:50,520 on a specific thermal history in a specific way that those particles are 61 00:04:50,520 --> 00:04:53,430 making dark matter and if you change those, then you change maybe the 62 00:04:53,430 --> 00:04:57,600 phenomenological signatures and coupling ranges that are of interest. And then 63 00:04:57,600 --> 00:05:02,490 finally, what happens if we move to words Non perturbative are many body signatures, 64 00:05:02,490 --> 00:05:07,350 right? Got lots of new states showing up like confining sectors and dark showers. 65 00:05:07,980 --> 00:05:11,760 So let's start with the non minimal couplings and your sense of what I mean. 66 00:05:12,330 --> 00:05:19,020 So if you think about dark photons, or dark scalars, these couple, the same way 67 00:05:19,020 --> 00:05:24,000 as regular photons are the standard model takes just time some small overall mixing 68 00:05:24,000 --> 00:05:29,640 factor. And as we will see some of the talks to come. There's really impressive 69 00:05:29,640 --> 00:05:36,120 coverage that's beginning to take shape for many of these signatures. And we 70 00:05:36,120 --> 00:05:39,540 haven't seen any evidence yet, so we're just piling up more and more constraints. 71 00:05:40,980 --> 00:05:45,720 And these usually come from the coupling of the dark photons that are scalars to 72 00:05:45,930 --> 00:05:50,100 standard model particles that are easy to access and experiments like coupling to 73 00:05:50,100 --> 00:05:54,630 electrons or coupling the top quarks. At the same time as we continue to improve 74 00:05:54,630 --> 00:05:58,950 our exclusions there are anomalies and hints of new things that continue to 75 00:05:58,950 --> 00:06:04,620 accrue. So for instance, new on G minus two is a persistent discrepancy with the 76 00:06:04,620 --> 00:06:10,800 standard model. There are, of course, the anomalies in electronic similar time. BDK 77 00:06:10,800 --> 00:06:16,170 is possible upon flavor stuff going on there. The Koto anomaly is a new thing of 78 00:06:16,170 --> 00:06:21,720 the past year, and so on. And if we want to try and accommodate one or more of 79 00:06:21,720 --> 00:06:27,000 these within the standard framework, this is often excluded in the minimal case. And 80 00:06:27,000 --> 00:06:30,870 so the workaround for this is to just say, well, let's just shut off this most 81 00:06:30,870 --> 00:06:36,270 important coupling that's often used to constrain these new particles. And this 82 00:06:36,270 --> 00:06:42,180 can weaken the constraints on the models and potentially open up the viability in 83 00:06:42,180 --> 00:06:45,660 terms of explaining some of these examples. And we'll talk about one 84 00:06:45,660 --> 00:06:50,370 scenario, which is something that I've worked on in terms of searches with a bar 85 00:06:50,370 --> 00:06:54,360 experiment, which is what I call electrophilic scalar. So it's a scalar. 86 00:06:54,540 --> 00:06:57,930 The couple's masks unfortunately, just like the Higgs, but a couple's 87 00:06:57,930 --> 00:06:59,880 predominantly to leptons, as opposed to 88 00:07:01,410 --> 00:07:07,440 And this was shown recently that it could potentially, for instance, simultaneously 89 00:07:07,440 --> 00:07:13,410 explain the new g minus two and the Koto anomaly. But if we look at this plot on 90 00:07:13,440 --> 00:07:17,250 the lower right, if you ignore the green curve, which is what the experiment just 91 00:07:17,250 --> 00:07:22,290 recently did, actually, most of them laundry minus two parameter space was open 92 00:07:22,320 --> 00:07:28,500 and really uncovered. And so what we did was we did a search where the dominant 93 00:07:28,500 --> 00:07:31,800 production mode of this is not going to be directly off of the electrons but off of 94 00:07:31,800 --> 00:07:35,880 final state radiation from towers, which which it has the largest coupling and then 95 00:07:35,880 --> 00:07:41,040 it will decay and to save your lines or electrons. And this requires doing a 96 00:07:41,040 --> 00:07:45,360 search at finite lifetime. So, we're sort of having to bring in a lot of different 97 00:07:45,540 --> 00:07:50,430 interesting modules initially of hidden sectors. And the short version is we 98 00:07:50,430 --> 00:07:55,830 didn't see anything, and we exclude this whole green region which greatly 99 00:07:55,860 --> 00:08:01,380 eliminates the view on T minus two parameter space below the top shot. And 100 00:08:01,410 --> 00:08:05,340 this is interesting both because it shows the power that a single search can have to 101 00:08:05,340 --> 00:08:09,660 improve our sensitivity. But also the fact that, you know, the sensitivity dies off 102 00:08:09,660 --> 00:08:13,530 as soon as the thing starts decaying into Taos as well. And so if we have a 103 00:08:13,530 --> 00:08:18,600 completely tau philic scalar, there's a lot of open parameter space. So this might 104 00:08:18,600 --> 00:08:23,220 be a zooming in for our attention, as you know, are there ways that we can try and 105 00:08:23,220 --> 00:08:27,510 access this parameter space? So what are some things that I think are open 106 00:08:27,510 --> 00:08:30,540 opportunities with respect to these non mental couplings? Like I said, I think 107 00:08:30,540 --> 00:08:36,690 Catholic forces things a couple probably to nuance as opposed to electrons are a 108 00:08:36,690 --> 00:08:41,220 major gap and possible explanation and being rungy minus two particularly below 109 00:08:41,220 --> 00:08:48,660 the diamond threshold and at high masses. So in the Atlas CMS range of interest, and 110 00:08:48,660 --> 00:08:51,720 also accent like particles, which are particles that coupled predominantly to 111 00:08:51,720 --> 00:08:56,760 pairs of gauge bosons and photons, electric boat, those odds include bonds 112 00:08:57,600 --> 00:09:02,700 and so you know, While we should continue to press ahead on these minimal scenarios, 113 00:09:02,700 --> 00:09:09,210 we should also see if there's something hiding in some of these other cases. What 114 00:09:09,210 --> 00:09:13,740 about if we changed the dynamics in the early universe are we consider different 115 00:09:13,770 --> 00:09:19,500 types of ways of explaining Dark Matter abundance. Until recently thermal freeze 116 00:09:19,500 --> 00:09:23,670 out which is the mechanism for explaining the dark matter, abundance and rent models 117 00:09:23,910 --> 00:09:30,330 was the major way of thinking about how we come about dark matter abundance. But as 118 00:09:30,330 --> 00:09:36,720 we know, we have not seen any positive signals in wimps searches nor in you know, 119 00:09:36,720 --> 00:09:41,250 some searches for lighter versions of thermal dark matter and indirect detection 120 00:09:41,250 --> 00:09:42,510 and direct detection, so on. 121 00:09:43,860 --> 00:09:48,570 And so we can wonder, well, is this the actual way the dark matter is determined 122 00:09:48,570 --> 00:09:53,400 and the answer is maybe not. So as soon as we have multiple component hidden sectors 123 00:09:53,400 --> 00:09:58,590 with mediators and dark matter particles with different masses and couplings, we 124 00:09:58,590 --> 00:10:03,240 can actually get a very wide range of subjects very creatively named, dark 125 00:10:03,240 --> 00:10:06,360 matter things. So there were so many references here, I couldn't fit them on 126 00:10:06,360 --> 00:10:09,930 the slide. But if you just Google any of these, I guarantee that things will pop 127 00:10:09,960 --> 00:10:14,730 up. But it's probably the easiest way. So if you're ever bored and depressed, that 128 00:10:14,730 --> 00:10:17,820 we haven't found dark matter, just look up some of these and get some sense of how 129 00:10:17,820 --> 00:10:23,940 rich, docile Dark Matter dynamics can be. I'm going to talk about a variant which is 130 00:10:24,030 --> 00:10:30,630 pretty simple, but it's called freezin. And it's a scenario where the dark matter 131 00:10:30,630 --> 00:10:34,470 is so weakly coupled, that it never comes into equilibrium is never abundantly 132 00:10:34,470 --> 00:10:40,470 produced in the early universe. And in these cases, dark matter is just produced 133 00:10:40,470 --> 00:10:43,830 from the decay of some scalar that carries Standard Model charge, for instance, and 134 00:10:43,830 --> 00:10:47,910 you just accumulate Dark Matter slowly over time. And as the temperature of the 135 00:10:47,910 --> 00:10:52,410 universe evolves, and as we go through time, you make it and then at some point, 136 00:10:52,410 --> 00:10:55,770 you stop making it it just happened amount, and you can calculate how much 137 00:10:55,770 --> 00:11:01,140 that amount is and it's roughly this given by the bottom of screen and you can see 138 00:11:01,140 --> 00:11:06,810 that for kind of reasonable masses, you get very tiny couplings or 10 to the minus 139 00:11:06,870 --> 00:11:09,900 eight. So this can be interesting predictions along with particle 140 00:11:09,900 --> 00:11:14,910 signatures. And this is kind of come back into vogue recently because it's 141 00:11:15,180 --> 00:11:20,760 relatively untested type of dark matter scenario. I've become interested in AI 142 00:11:20,760 --> 00:11:25,170 recently because it turns out that this same interaction, if you have two or more 143 00:11:25,170 --> 00:11:30,330 dark matter particles, can also give you the matter antimatter asymmetry almost for 144 00:11:30,330 --> 00:11:34,830 free with similar kinds of couplings. But over a much more constrained parameter 145 00:11:34,830 --> 00:11:39,720 space, it's actually quite testable. So over here on the left shows the mass of 146 00:11:39,720 --> 00:11:44,400 this scalar, which carries Standard Model charges and the lifetime and you can see 147 00:11:44,400 --> 00:11:47,430 that in order to get the bearings and do the work, which is in these shaded 148 00:11:47,430 --> 00:11:52,710 regions, you actually have to have the scalar be within kinematic range vhc. And 149 00:11:52,710 --> 00:11:56,790 in the lifetime range, it's also an interest for different sector searches. 150 00:11:56,790 --> 00:12:00,840 And so we got, for instance, cares of lung lip particles, each of which decays to a 151 00:12:00,840 --> 00:12:06,180 single standard model particle plus mad. And so this is, could be a clear signature 152 00:12:06,210 --> 00:12:10,650 of both the dark matter production as well as a matter antimatter asymmetry coming in 153 00:12:10,650 --> 00:12:15,600 one bundle. And this is the only way the freezing could happen. For instance, 154 00:12:15,600 --> 00:12:19,140 instead of having a TV scale Meteor, we could have a low mass and the leader like 155 00:12:19,140 --> 00:12:23,580 a dark photon, there's recently been a lot of theoretical work that's been going into 156 00:12:23,820 --> 00:12:27,480 calculating what's going on in the early universe plasma effects that are relevant 157 00:12:27,480 --> 00:12:33,030 at those scales. And this has been opening up some parameter space for Dark Matter 158 00:12:33,030 --> 00:12:37,560 also in the kind of K 10s of k v to hundreds of k v scale, the producer very 159 00:12:37,560 --> 00:12:40,980 different mechanism, predicting new signals inferences, direct detection 160 00:12:40,980 --> 00:12:46,050 experiments, astrophysical probes, cosmology and so on. So by tricking our 161 00:12:46,380 --> 00:12:50,130 our prejudice or our views of what Dark Matter could be and how its produced we 162 00:12:50,130 --> 00:12:56,310 also expand our range of phenomenological probes. Within the last couple of minutes, 163 00:12:56,310 --> 00:12:59,790 I want to touch briefly on the non perturbative in many body signatures, 164 00:12:59,790 --> 00:13:03,120 which is Not gonna be super extensive because this is still a relatively 165 00:13:03,120 --> 00:13:09,510 emerging field. But in these scenarios, you might consider our hidden sectors 166 00:13:09,510 --> 00:13:14,490 where the dark matter carries some charge under a dark confining force, and so it 167 00:13:14,490 --> 00:13:19,500 undergoes apart on shower, and then hunter ization much like you see. And in these 168 00:13:19,500 --> 00:13:24,810 scenarios, the dark hadrons can decay properly or long lived. And because we 169 00:13:24,810 --> 00:13:27,960 don't know anything about this dark, confining forest, the shower properties 170 00:13:27,960 --> 00:13:32,340 are unknown. And they could range anywhere between the jet like features like we see 171 00:13:32,340 --> 00:13:35,700 in the bottom left, or we could end up with something that's very kind of 172 00:13:35,700 --> 00:13:39,510 isotopic radiation patterns that you see on the right. Then, of course, there's an 173 00:13:39,510 --> 00:13:43,980 open question about well, if I change the knobs of the theory, do I move smoothly 174 00:13:43,980 --> 00:13:46,890 from the picture on the left to the right, you know, do it go through some 175 00:13:47,310 --> 00:13:51,030 interesting intermediate phase? And this is hard to answer theoretically because of 176 00:13:51,030 --> 00:13:57,600 the non perturbative nature. So, you know, this is a new area of experimental study. 177 00:13:57,600 --> 00:14:01,320 There's, as far as I'm aware, one public was often seen So we know that Atlas is 178 00:14:01,320 --> 00:14:01,920 working on 179 00:14:03,240 --> 00:14:06,810 a search for similar kinds of models, these so called a virgin jets with long 180 00:14:06,810 --> 00:14:11,430 lift, two K's of these dark hadron. So this shows that it is feasible. And it's 181 00:14:11,430 --> 00:14:15,540 interesting and that we need to do better to understand it for theoretically and in 182 00:14:15,540 --> 00:14:20,160 terms of experimental sensitivity. And just in the past month, there's been 183 00:14:20,160 --> 00:14:24,450 several papers that have come out that have investigated for instance, new events 184 00:14:24,450 --> 00:14:27,900 shape variables that are kind of like thrust, or they're based on something 185 00:14:27,900 --> 00:14:33,510 called the energy movers distance that can distinguish a digest sample from isotropic 186 00:14:33,780 --> 00:14:38,940 distributions that have different numbers of particles per events ranging from 10 to 187 00:14:38,940 --> 00:14:43,170 50. And you see that they're all separated from one another, as well as new 188 00:14:43,170 --> 00:14:47,340 applications of jet substructure variables like energy correlation functions that can 189 00:14:47,340 --> 00:14:51,900 be used to distinguish QED showers from these dark showers. This is very much an 190 00:14:51,900 --> 00:14:56,130 early stages and so it's a great opportunity for new theory and 191 00:14:56,130 --> 00:15:02,760 experimental development. So I'm out of time So we'll leave it here. I think that 192 00:15:02,760 --> 00:15:07,170 to the sector's there's been a really impressive development and search program 193 00:15:07,170 --> 00:15:11,310 for them. And we still have a lot of interesting things to look at the LFC has 194 00:15:11,310 --> 00:15:15,270 a really important role to play and testing, particularly sort of Hidden 195 00:15:15,270 --> 00:15:20,400 Valley scenarios or scenarios where you have a heavier mediator relative to other 196 00:15:20,580 --> 00:15:25,470 lower energy experiments. And stay tuned because we have three great talks that are 197 00:15:25,470 --> 00:15:28,200 going to show just some of the exciting results from these efforts. 198 00:15:32,340 --> 00:15:36,600 Thanks a lot, Brian. That was both a fascinating talk and on time to within 199 00:15:36,600 --> 00:15:44,190 plus or minus one second. So I have any questions from the attendees, the other 200 00:15:44,190 --> 00:15:47,760 speakers, use the raise your hand option zoom will be able to unmute you. 201 00:15:56,940 --> 00:15:57,480 Go ahead, Mary. 202 00:16:00,000 --> 00:16:03,780 was wondering if you could say a few more words about the energy movers distance and 203 00:16:03,780 --> 00:16:06,000 what it is exactly. This new variable? 204 00:16:06,870 --> 00:16:11,100 Yeah, so I was not involved in this. So I've only kind of glanced at the paper. 205 00:16:11,100 --> 00:16:14,790 But I think the rough idea is, so it's based on something called the Earthmovers 206 00:16:14,790 --> 00:16:18,420 distance, which is a problem in computer science, which is that if I have two 207 00:16:18,420 --> 00:16:23,250 distributions of masses in space, and you can ask what's the minimal way that I can 208 00:16:23,250 --> 00:16:27,600 rearrange math so that I moved from pattern age to pattern B. What this 209 00:16:28,020 --> 00:16:34,080 variable does is it compares a particular event which has some distribution in phi 210 00:16:34,080 --> 00:16:39,390 and pseudo rapidity. And then it asks if this were a purely isotopic event, I can 211 00:16:39,390 --> 00:16:44,280 compare those two pictures and what's the minimum amount of energy that I have to 212 00:16:44,280 --> 00:16:49,290 expend to change one to the other. And the paper goes into great detail of how they 213 00:16:49,290 --> 00:16:53,040 define exactly the waiting and the metric of this but the rough idea is that if it's 214 00:16:53,040 --> 00:16:56,190 already isotopic, you don't have to rearrange the events at all. And so it has 215 00:16:56,190 --> 00:17:01,050 a very small energy movers distance whereas if it's a diner Like then you have 216 00:17:01,050 --> 00:17:03,450 to expend a lot of this normalized. 217 00:17:12,450 --> 00:17:16,680 interest, just for my understanding on this plot as well. I was curious about it 218 00:17:16,680 --> 00:17:21,120 to the end in this case is the number of initial particles you have creating the 219 00:17:21,150 --> 00:17:22,920 energy distributions you're looking at, or? 220 00:17:23,280 --> 00:17:27,960 Yeah, so this was a, I picked this one because it kind of showed the the most 221 00:17:27,990 --> 00:17:32,700 distinguishing power even though it's perhaps a little bit of an artificial 222 00:17:32,700 --> 00:17:36,120 setup, we're basically out there saying, I'm not going to go into the details of 223 00:17:36,120 --> 00:17:40,170 the model, I'm just going to generate events that have kind of isotropic ish 224 00:17:40,170 --> 00:17:46,470 distributions of say, 50 particles compared to say QC D digest events. And 225 00:17:46,500 --> 00:17:50,670 the remarkable thing is that so if for instance, you showed the corresponding 226 00:17:50,670 --> 00:17:54,750 plot for thrust, which if you look at the paper, it's there or some other events, 227 00:17:54,750 --> 00:17:59,880 shape variables, it's hard to distinguish the 1025 and 50. You can distinguish maybe 228 00:17:59,880 --> 00:18:03,810 the From QC dB, you can't tell them apart. Whereas this is really sensitive to like 229 00:18:03,810 --> 00:18:06,180 how many particles Do I need to rearrange? 230 00:18:09,240 --> 00:18:14,010 testing? we maybe have time for one more question for Brian. What else hustler? 231 00:18:19,710 --> 00:18:24,330 Okay, in that case, thanks again. This was very interesting. And let's move on to our 232 00:18:24,330 --> 00:18:26,130 next speaker, which I believe is Constantine